name 'one' pro-life justice

[Dementia_Madness]

And yet, so many will not stand up and fights for the right for others to have life...it is sad. All it takes for evil to win is fot good to do nothing. In fact this is just evidence that  many who conside themselves "good" are not really good at all.

[KNOWLEDGE]

Roe v Wade is another example of how the liberals use the judicial system to get their agendas forced onto the American people.    They would never have gotten this passed if thru the legislative branch of the government and it would definitely not get passed if the American public voted on it.

[NCVol]

Ii suspect that if you threw it back to the states, like before Roe, we'd have some states where abortion WAS legal, others where it was not. 

And the surveys greatly depend on how you ask the question and define "right to life."  Most everyone is "against" abortion, but I'd say most also don't want doctors or pregnant women imprisoned for it either.  I'm not sure how people would feel about outlawing in vitro fertilization, since the process creates many fertilized eggs, aka life, or outlawing common birth control methods that result in very early "abortions."  I'd say there is widespread support for outlawing late term abortions, but again, depending on how you define the health of the mother. 

[Dementia_Madness]

Most everyone is "against" abortion, but I'd say most also don't want doctors or pregnant women imprisoned for it either.

I am sorry for women who feel that murdering their children is a solution to any problem. The fact is they have been told by the government and doctors it is not murder, and it is not a baby. Some women are victims, just as the babies are, though not to the same extreme. But it's foolish to argue against abortion by saying, because we do not want to throw people in jail for something that is vile and wicked, we are going to allow them to do a vile and wicked thing. Abortion is as vile as child molestation, in fact it is worse, abortion is worse than kidnapping, abortion is worse than drunk driving, yet because we feel sorry for the criminals, more sorry than we do for the greater victims the murdered babies, we say ignore it.

We should have some degree of mercy for the women, we should look at each case on a person by person basis, the fact is if it was acknowledged that it was criminal to take a way unborn children's lives, each person convicted would have their day before a criminal court, that is a privileged  and a right that 100% of aborted babies do not have today. That is what I am arguing for, every innocent human at least deserves to have his day in court, and if the criminal justice system can prove that an unborn child is guilty of a capitol crime, then by all means let justice be done, but we all know that is not true, and NO BABY deserves to be murdered, not one.

People keep making rabbit holes to chase down with the discussion, well we don't know when life begins, what about in vitro fertilization, what about this and what about that? the truth is because we cannot answer all the question as easily, does not mean we should not attempt to answer the easy ones, is a pre-born infant a human being and do they deserve their rights protected? If we cannot answer the easy questions, if we are afraid to answer the OBVIOUS ones, because we are afraid to tackle the more complex ones, we are cowards, fools, and I must say deserving of the utmost condemnation and indeed damnation, all of us.

[KNOWLEDGE]

NCV, you can use all of the liberal talking points you want to try and "pretty" this up, but abortion is still murder and the majority of Americans are against it.

[Dementia_Madness]

Truth is Knowledge, it matters very little if "most" Americans are against abortion, we are heading to a time, because it is the pro-abortionists educating our children, when most Americans will probably think abortion is okay. The fact is there was a time when "MOST" American's believed it was okay to own another person as property. There was a time when abortion was illegal. Even if the majority of Americans think abortion is okay, does not mean it should be okay. Just because the majority of American's think it's wrong today, does not mean it is wrong. It is wrong, because it is wrong, it is taking an innocent human life, and that is wrong, no matter if everyone alive in the world today thought it was right, it would still be wrong. If i was the ONLY person who thought it was wrong, it would still be just as wrong as if it were only FL thought it was okay.

Fact is that is why we are not a true democracy, because a true democracy is mob rule, while our laws and constitution, our very AMERICAN NATURE HAS BEEN about personal liberty and protection being equal to public liberty and protections. Our laws are made to protect the public, but also to acknowledge that individuals have rights beyond the will of the "people" and even if the majority of American's who happen to be white, woke up one day and decided that every minority no longer had a right to life, it would not be OKAY, and it would not be right.

[KNOWLEDGE]

. Just because the majority of American's think it's wrong today, does not mean it is wrong. It is wrong, because it is wrong, it is taking an innocent human life, and that is wrong, no matter if everyone alive in the world today thought it was right, it would still be wrong. If i was the ONLY person who thought it was wrong, it would still be just as wrong as if it were only FL thought it was okay.

 .

I agree with that.    I just dont' know how we let abortion become accepted much less the law

[Dementia_Madness]

Because, the original argument for ROE V WADE was not truly an argument about abortion, it was about the right to privacy. Today the arguments that the evil pro baby murderers and their supporters use are all the rabbit holes and "what ifs" that people like NcVol and PV like to keep using. They know the truth, yet choose to make so many different arguments that MOST people cannot keep up with them all or come up with answers to them all, it is a strategy the wicked love to use, and sadly even good people fall prey to it.

[NCVol]

People keep making rabbit holes to chase down with the discussion, well we don't know when life begins, what about in vitro fertilization, what about this and what about that? the truth is because we cannot answer all the question as easily, does not mean we should not attempt to answer the easy ones, is a pre-born infant a human being and do they deserve their rights protected? If we cannot answer the easy questions, if we are afraid to answer the OBVIOUS ones, because we are afraid to tackle the more complex ones, we are cowards, fools, and I must say deserving of the utmost condemnation and indeed damnation, all of us.

When life begins is the ENTIRE controversy - if a person has an opinion on that, unless they are an idiot, that will determine where they stand on abortion.  And to me there are only two positions.  Life begins at conception or it begins at birth.  And it's obvious what your stance is on abortion once you decide where life begins. 

I suppose your argument is we should start with what we can do, which is deal with abortion in the common form, where there is no dispute about there being an emerging infant.  I don't have a problem with that, except that it IS a form of hypocrisy to ignore things like in vitro.  If the argument is that life begins at conception, there is no moral distinction between an late term abortion at 7 or 8 months and various forms of abortions occurring at 2 weeks.  Conceding that there is an argument for allowing a woman to create a dozen fertilized eggs that will absolutely be eventually discarded for the purpose of one successful implantation is to obliterate the entire moral argument against abortion, IMO.  

I'm assuming you're saying you'd rather have some abortion prohibited and some allowed than have all allowed with no restrictions.  

[Dementia_Madness]

NC its foolishness to say we are IGNORING in vitro fertilization, truth is IF we do not agree that there is life to begin with, there is no argument. There is no point arguing in vitro if we cannot come to common ground on the issue of LIFE and RIGHTS to begin with. FIRST we MUST acknowledge what gives us rights to live, and then work from there to define the legal protections afforded due to that right. IF WE CANNOT HAVE A RIGHT TO LIFE why even argue any other rights, who truly has rights anyway.

You offer more rabbit holes, and this does noting to solve the problems, let alone address in vitro or any other issue involved with the repercussions. I am so tired of hearing people talk about HYPOCRISY, the fact is even if I am and hypocrite, or you are a hypocrite, it has NOTHING to do with whether or not a living child has any rights, or the most important right, the right to life. more rabbit holes.

I'm assuming you're saying you'd rather have some abortion prohibited and some allowed than have all allowed with no restrictions.  

Likie I said show me where those babies deserve the death penalty and we can start from there, if YOU think they are alive before birth then YOU have to explain how a simple matter like location removes their rights, and if you do not believe they are alive prior to birth, then you have to explain why then they must be killed, non-living things do not need to be killed.

Conceding that there is an argument for allowing a woman to create a dozen fertilized eggs that will absolutely be eventually discarded for the purpose of one successful implantation is to obliterate the entire moral argument against abortion, IMO.  

Just to touch your ARGUMENT, why MUST ANY fertilized eggs be discarded? IF they are given rights, then they cannot be discarded...but then again what would be the purpose of discarding them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snowflake_children
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/07/28/national/main712541.shtml
http://newsbusters.org/node/6549

[plumbervol]

Life begins at conception, or I don't know when life begins but lets not take a chance. Both are good arguments and we all know that life in precious, but what about those that don't believe life begins at conception but feel that abortion allows those that sin to beat the consequences? In other words the real wrong in abortion is upsurping Gods wrath on the sinner, thus it is a true sacriledge to God...

Consider this Charlie Manson was found in a dumpster by police and was sold once by his mother for a pitcher of beer to a childless waitress, from whom his uncle retrieved him some days later. Later his mother tried to have her son placed in a foster home but failed because no such home was available. The court placed Manson in Gibault School for Boys, in Terre Haute, Indiana. After 10 months, he fled from there to his mother, who rejected him.

Or even Fallon Tallent from Maryville. She killed two officers in an attempt to run through a roadblock. Her Grandmother raised her, you see her mother was a Junkie prostitute who lacked the money to abort her in late term. Her mother tried to use chemicals to cause an abortion and failed. She has a son who she did not abort because she knew her history and believed abortion was murder. The great grandmother who raised both the junkie prostitute mother and the junkie killer granddaughter gets to raise the great grandson!!!!

What  if they had been aborted? Innocent people would have been sparred murder. And the two innocent neglected children Charlie  and Fallon would have went straight to heaven!! But the parents would have been sparred Gods wrath!!

[Flummoxed Lummox]

NCV, you can use all of the liberal talking points you want to try and "pretty" this up, but abortion is still murder and the majority of Americans are against it.

You're full of ... as usual.